Commons:Graphics village pump

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Graphics community: Graphic Lab · Graphics Village Pump · Picture Requests · Photography Critiques

color palette logo Welcome to the Graphics village pump!

A village pump

Hello and Welcome to this Graphics village pump of Commons. This Graphics village pump aims to provide help and information about the several Graphic Labs spread in the Wikipedias, and to be the technical support forum for all the local Labs, graphists (graphic artists), and users interested in graphic works, and is a page where graphists and users from all the Labs can talk about graphics, tutorials, graphic software, help to build new Graphic Labs, etc. Also for exchanging opinions, ideas, protocols, and ways of improvement.

See also: Other graphic community pages (list on top) | Graphics abilities page | Graphic Tool | Project Insignia | Stroke Order Project

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Contents


Graphics village pump archives:

[edit] May_2012

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[edit] What did I do to this SVG file?

Usenet traffic per day (en).svg

I recently uploaded a new version of File:Usenet traffic per day (en).svg, which was generated by Gnuplot and edited in Inkscape. I converted the text to paths, but the text is horribly mangled as rendered by MediaWiki; Safari has no problem displaying the text correctly. Purging the page's cache had no effect. Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug in MediaWiki? Cheers, bdesham ★ 15:44, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I fixed the problem by having Gnuplot generate the SVG directly (instead of converting Gnuplot's PDF to SVG with Inkscape). My issue still applies to older versions of the file. --bdesham ★ 15:51, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
You declare Helvetica as a font, but the svg backend only knows these fonts meta:SVG fonts
AnonMoos, I opened a new bug, concerning the declaration of SVG fonts here [1]--DieBuche (talk) 20:10, 25 May 2010 (UTC)


[edit] SVG image thumbnail not displaying

Languages of Europe

Does anyone know why the thumbnail for this image is not displaying? It is interesting to note (as pointed out by User:Saibo, here) that anything below 694px width does not work (or only partially works): 694px works but not 693px. Thanks, Hayden120 (talk) 03:32, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Maybe because of sodipodi stuff in the file? Try saving as plain SVG. Btw, there is an artifact in iceland --Georg-Johann (talk) 17:35, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

[edit] Wikimedia renders Deja and Liberation fonts badly

Liberation Sans font and saved as plain SVG. 300 pixel thumb. Check the 200px and 500px renderings, even 2000px has a minor problem.
Liberation Sans font and saved as plain SVG. 200 pixel thumb.
And this renders Ok after five path elements were manually removed, see description for full details

Or is it the way I am using Inkscape 0.47? All these files render perfectly in my Opera browser (version 10.54 build 21868) and I have installed DejaVu and Liberation Sans fonts on Windows Vista.

Here is the start of the SVG code for File:Ikaros solar sail key liberation sans plain.svg:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8" standalone="no"?>

<svg
  xmlns:svg="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg"
  xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg"
  version="1.1"
  width="643.56433"
  height="257.42575"
  id="svg2852">

 <defs
    id="defs2854" />
 <g
    transform="translate(-58.921894,66.069669)"
    id="layer1">
   <text
      x="69.253036"
      y="-29.653135"
      id="text3167"
      xml:space="preserve"
      style="font-size:32px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;font-stretch:normal;text-align:start;line-height:100%;writing-mode:lr-tb;text-anchor:start;fill:#000000;fill-opacity:1;stroke:none;font-family:DejaVu Sans;-inkscape-font-specification:DejaVu Sans"><tspan
        x="69.253036"
        y="-29.653135"
        id="tspan3169">1</tspan></text>

Here is the SVG code for the first use of the Liberation Sans font "Tip mass 0.5 kg" (which renders fine):

    <text
      x="164.86249"
      y="-28.66876"
      id="text3304"
      xml:space="preserve"
      style="font-size:32px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;font-stretch:normal;text-align:start;line-height:100%;writing-mode:lr-tb;text-anchor:start;fill:#000000;fill-opacity:1;stroke:none;font-family:Liberation Sans;-inkscape-font-specification:Liberation Sans"><tspan
        x="164.86249"
        y="-28.66876"
        id="tspan3308">Tip mass 0.5 kg</tspan></text>

And here is the SVG code for the "Main body" text (which renders bad):

   <text
      x="159.24414"
      y="179.82025"
      id="text3304-3-6"
      xml:space="preserve"
      style="font-size:32px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;font-stretch:normal;text-align:start;line-height:100%;writing-mode:lr-tb;text-anchor:start;fill:#000000;fill-opacity:1;stroke:none;font-family:Liberation Sans;-inkscape-font-specification:Liberation Sans"><tspan
        x="159.24414"
        y="179.82025"
        id="tspan3684">Main body</tspan></text>

-84user (talk) 18:32, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Update: In case bugzilla:8898 is relevant to this problem I posted a querying note there linking here. -84user (talk) 19:49, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

More update: I *believe* I have narrowed down the SVG code that causes the rendering problem to a sequence of 5 path elements. See File:Ikaros_solar_sail_key_plain_edited.svg for details. -84user (talk) 20:56, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

More more: File:Ikaros solar sail key plain minusthosefivepaths.svg shows more evidence that the renderer has problems with those five path elements. -84user (talk) 21:10, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Even this version has problems in the 2000px version --DieBuche (talk) 21:19, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
See Commons:Graphics_village_pump/May_2010#SVG_text_rendering for previous complaints along the same lines. If you understand why I had to render text to paths in image File:Simple inverse relationship chart.svg, then please explain it to me... AnonMoos (talk) 10:43, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
All these symptoms strongly suggest to me a low-level bug (like a buffer overrun or something similar) in the rsvg library, further confirmed by the fact that I can reproduce them locally using the rsvg-view utility. It should probably be reported to the developers of that project. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 15:56, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

[edit] SVG typography and Wikimedia's PNG renderer

I've always struggled with Wikimedia's SVG PNG renderer based on font issues. We all know it doesn't allow embedding of fonts, which can be a real pain to the designer. I have recently created File:Integration in Deutsch.svg and File:Integration in English.svg in Adobe Illustrator. I notice after creating the Deutsch, that Illustrator had added a font-family tag for "Myriad", which is ignored by the PNG renderer. So for my next image, the English version, I simply edited the file by hand to remove all references to Myriad. This created an odd result: the PNG render has really messed up letter spacing (specifically after the letter "m"). When I click on the thumbnail to allow firefox to render the SVG by itself, everything looks ok on my setup. As for the Duetsch version, the text in the red boxes in the PNG thumbnail is too larger, while it looks OK when viewing the SVG by itself in Firefox. Because of the typographical limitations in the PNG renderer, I basically have been ignoring most typographical settings, as I don't know what will or will not work with the renderer, but I'm also learning that the default settings are not ideal either. So I'm asking two questions, one general, and one specific. Specifically, what would you suggest be done to fix the two described errors for each image (text runs outside red box in Duetsch, letter spacing is wonky in English)? More generally, what are some good typographic tips that are compatible with the PNG renderer? What settings work? What typefaces are allowed? What works for you? Thanks for any input. Instead of fighting with the renderer, I'm hoping I can learn to work with it, within its very limited scope. Thanks! -Andrew c (talk) 16:26, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Have exactly the same problem. This post is extremely relevent, as I don't know what to do other than trial and error. Jolly Janner (talk) 22:13, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

I have changed the font in both pictures to DejaVu Sans Condensed. For all fonts available see [2]. Uwe Dedering (talk) 18:22, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

OT: I really like the style of the image. --DieBuche (talk) 18:46, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
Not OT: Me too.(but the filename could be better...)  :-) Uwe Dedering (talk) 19:45, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
Use the page test.svg in order to see if the file look like as you want it to on wikipedia. Citypeek (talk) 05:37, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

A Illustrator->SVG graphist here. The only font that reliably displays for me in thumbnail is DejaVu Sans (too bad I prefer other typefaces). I've tried others on the list of "fonts available" like Liberation, Helvetica, and DejaVu Serif; using various combinations of SVG/Adobe CEF/glyphs settings. Some of the other fonts work in the full version, others are changed to a serif font that looks like Times, and I can't figure why and when the strange behaviours occur. Jon C (talk) 16:35, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

[edit] Introducing SVG Check

For those of you that didn't catch my announcement on the main village pump a couple of weeks back, I urge you to take a look at Commons:SVG Check. You can leave any comments on the talk page, and I shall endeavour to fix them. Also, your suggestions for which errors can be easily caught and how best to fix them are appreciated: the current debugging code is available at the top of [3], and you can see that the list is not too long at the moment, so I need your help! :) Thanks, Jarry1250 (talk) 12:27, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Didn't know about this page. Thank you for pointing it out. I have bookmarked it. Citypeek (talk) 05:56, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

[edit] Text shown in bold

I am completely new to Inkscape and I tried to translate (svgtranslate didn’t work) an image because an article it is used in on Swedish Wikipedia is nominated for featured status, and for this, all images have to be in Swedish. The font looked like Arial so I used Arial and it worked fine. However the text that wasn’t bold became bold when I uploaded it, and a bracket or two were moved. It wouldn’t have been that bad if it weren’t for one original text box that I left, which still isn’t in bold. here’s the original image, and here’s my attempted translation. The text I’m talking about is at the far right (the species). Later I discovered that Arial is problematic and tried to change it using the instructions (replacing fontfamily) but it didn’t seem to help. Does anyone maybe have a solution? Thank you very much! --Lundgren8 (t · c) 20:35, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

[edit] More font strangeness

File:Shield Trinity (zh-cn).svg and File:Shield Trinity (zh-hant).svg have identical font formatting (the only difference being that one was uploaded about a year after the other), yet they display rather differently, with the rendering of the one uploaded last year being more satisfactory. These unexplained variations and retrogressions in font display are what have driven some uploaders to exasperated frustration... AnonMoos (talk) 13:11, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

  • Shield Trinity (zh-cn).svg
  • Shield Trinity (zh-hant).svg
I have seen the same, but should say that for the Tamil script it is better now than before... So much so that I am tempted to re-upload the SVG files with very minor variation in comments or some such thing. VasuVR (talk, contribs) 02:41, 20 February 2012 (UTC)
Here are three images of "similar information" uploaded at 3 different times. -- VasuVR (talk, contribs) 10:14, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

  • Latest upload

  • Oldest upload

  • Intermediate upload

[edit] help with svg: much too large compared to png

I know svg files are preferred, and s.o. created an svg version of this 64kB png file here, but the result is 1.4MB. Is there a way to reduce that, or is it not important? Kwamikagami (talk) 22:37, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

Well, the base map used, File:BlankMap-World6.svg, is 1.53 MB, so your colorized version of it is not likely to be dramatically smaller... AnonMoos (talk) 09:43, 8 April 2012 (UTC)
Someone converted the original lo-res map to that, which IMO is overkill. I was wondering if there were a way to reduce the resolution. Kwamikagami (talk) 22:47, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
The least complicated way is to try to find a different base map (which has already been simplified/optimized), and colorize that. I sometimes import selected vector outlines into the Fontforge tool to simplify them, but that particular method would not be too practically useful for something like BlankMap-World6.svg... AnonMoos (talk) 02:42, 12 April 2012 (UTC)
Okay, thanks. Kwamikagami (talk) 21:52, 12 April 2012 (UTC)
P.S. Came across File:World map - low resolution.svg (which I had forgotten about). AnonMoos (talk) 05:57, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

[edit] Help with worldmap tool

I'm trying to fix File:BlankMap-World-162E.svg.

The borders of South Sudan were added by drawing a white line, rather than creating two new objects for Sudan and South Sudan. While I could approximate a fix manually by creating a new object for South Sudan and crudely matching the southern borders for Sudan, I want to do it properly. This means we need to regenerate a map with the script used to create it originally (Worldmap tool), based on the current up-to-date map.

I've installed Python and installed the scripts with no problem, and am now being once again reminded of how embarrassingly underqualified I feel use a computer. (The only programming that I do is fairly basic php stuff done in a test editor and tested XAMPP, and the only times I use the command line have been when I copy/paste exact syntax.)

I clicked on the nugsl-worldmap script, and provides pretty explicit instructions for using it ("i [filename]"; "m 162E"; "o [new filename]"). And yet I can't figure out how to actually run it. Not only don't I know the intermediate step involved in getting to the point of using the scripts, I don't know how to google it.

Thanks, —Quintucket (talk) 19:28, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

This is a Python scripting problem rather than a direct image-fixing problem, so you're more likely to get answers on a forum devoted specifically to Python... AnonMoos (talk) 06:08, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

[edit] Advice with de-watermarking

Hi. I'm not sure whether this is the right place to ask, but I wonder if anybody could give me some advice on watermark removal.

By estimating the watermark and then inverting it I've had some success removing the watermarks themselves, but I'm left with a roughly fleur-de-lys shaped area that's discoloured, where the watermark previously was.

The files in question are about 70 scans of early 19th century colour aquatint engravings, which can be found in Category:Pyne's Royal Residences -- essentially all the files in that category which have pale-coloured borders that haven't been cropped.

Examples of the discolouration can be seen e.g. on this building (link) to the right-hand side of the central section; or on this building (link), to the right of the shadow cast by the tree. As well as making light areas darker, the discolouration also makes areas of strong red or green lighter -- for example in this picture (link), the right of the fireplace is darkened, but the green wall next to it gets a pale stain; similarly in this one (link), the red wall is marked, next to the doorway; here (link) the red curtain is discoloured, around the doorway; and here (link) you can just see its effect on the brown of the books in the bookshelves. All the files are affected, but the problem can be less or more obvious, depending on the local content of the image.

The website I got the images from had a lower (50%) resolution file for each image, plus a higher-resolution image marked with a semi-transparent watermark. I imagine that the watermark was applied by adding a layer to the image, mostly transparent apart from the greyscale watermark itself, added with about 10% opacity. I've been able to get a reasonable estimate of the watermark itself, and remove it, by using Gimp's "grain extract" on the watermarked image against a scaled-up version of the unwatermarked low-res image; averaging the results obtained over a dozen or so images; inverting the result; and then adding the inverted result back to each watermarked image using Gimp's "grain merge".

I'm thinking that if the watermarked area ≈ 90% * original image + 10% * watermark, this has disposed of the 10% quite well -- but I'm still left with an area where the watermark had been, that is only 90% of the intensity of the original which is why it appears discoloured.

It seems to me it ought to be possible, therefore, to boost up the discoloured area to 110% (okay, for pedants, 111%), using a suitable mask, and thereby fix the image. But (and I may be missing something obvious), I'm not understanding why some areas are darkened and other areas are lightened -- so I can't quite see just how the affected area should be boosted up.

I do have a work-around. In this picture, where the stain became particularly obvious where it stuck up into the sky, I patched the affected area with a patch made from the low-res image combined with the highest-detail level from Gimp's wavelet decomposition of the de-watermarked image. It's not bad, but it's a bit soft, and there's some haloing visible around dark edges -- eg above the battlements, and to the right of the statue. I could probably do better, by comparing the de-watermarked image against an actual 50% downscaled version of itself to get the grain to extract, rather than just clicking on the wavelet decomposition filter. That might produce somewhat better results (though I might have to use another program because Gimp's 50% downscaling isn't very good). But I do feel there ought to be a simpler way, if I just knew the appropriate way to boost the affected area.

Presumably, this must be a fairly standard thing to have to deal with, when trying to clean out semi-transparent watermarks. So can anybody advise what the right way is to treat discoloured areas left behind once the watermark itself has been removed? Jheald (talk) 16:37, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

In case it helps, I have temporarily uploaded my estimate of the watermark (or, more precisely, the negative of it) -- for the strictly time-limited purpose of facilitating this discussion only. Jheald (talk) 17:05, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

[edit] Fatal rendering error derails image update attempt

I attempted to improve File:2230 Kanji.svg by colour-coding the kanji according to the grade levels in which they are taught in Japanese schools. Unfortunately, the Commons SVG renderer thwarted my efforts by blotting out the text showing how to use the table with a big black box. Can anyone see if they can fix this? -- Denelson83 (talk) 03:18, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Never mind. After scrolling this page up and finding Jarry1250's convenient "SVG Check" tool, I found the problem using his innovation and fixed it. -- Denelson83 (talk) 03:31, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

[edit] Image size limit preference

I don't know why the "10000*10000px" option gone but expecting a technical explanation for its removal. Also I wish the "this image rendered as PNG in other sizes" for SVG file provides an "original size" option rather than few fixed values. Many SVG images are fine-turned for Wikimedia's SVG renderer so the image might not look right in other SVG renderers such as Inkscape or browser's native renderer. Thx. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 15:42, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

These are more Wikimedia configuration issues than issues with the images themselves; you might ask on the general village pump or file a "Bugzilla" bug report... AnonMoos (talk) 04:42, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

[edit] Rendering Problems

Hello villagers, I'm experiencing some trouble with File:Liniengleichnis.svg. All of the sudden two big brackets and some text are overshadowed by black boxes, although they looked kinda fine in previous versions (except when viewed in original resoultion). I've run several variations through Jarry1250's file checker - even if i remove the brackets and text, the black boxes remain. The problem seems to be caused by some float objects i can't really identify. To my astonishment, the file also contains troublesome font information, although inkscape should have converted all text objects into paths to avoid such problems. What should I do? Could someone have a look?Leif Czerny (talk) 15:12, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Mysterious black rectangles are almost always caused by Inkscape "flowtext" nonsense, and can be diagnosed at Commons:SVG Check... AnonMoos (talk) 15:38, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
Hi AnonMoos, I know about the check, but I don't know how to remove the 'flowtext', nor why it suddenly appears in this file at all. Could you please direct me towards a solution? Leif Czerny (talk) 15:41, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for the repair! Leif Czerny (talk) 16:33, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
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